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Really? Are we this intolerant as a race?
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Pecan Camari
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 11, 2010 6:40 pm    Post subject: Really? Are we this intolerant as a race? Reply with quote

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_lesbian_prom_date

This just... wow. What can I say?

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Benleopard
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 11, 2010 7:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Some people in the response both for and against the article. But the fact this takes place in the deep south is not that surprising.
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South_Munjoy
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 11, 2010 10:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Benleopard wrote:
Some people in the response both for and against the article. But the fact this takes place in the deep south is not that surprising.


This is true. On another note, you see some really odd juxtapositions of logic in the south as well. When I lived in South Carolina one thing that struck me as odd was a pickup truck with an Obama '08 sticker on one side of the rear bumper, and on the other side of the bumper a sticker that supported SC's constitutional amendment to deny rights for Gay people.
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Howellfan
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 12, 2010 4:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow....

My personal reaction is that there are two questions that should be asked here: first, was the schoolboard wrong? I think absolutely yes; However any of the board members may have personally felt about 'promoting'(if only in the most indirect, implicit manner, as organisers of the event) one position or another - and yes, I am making a conscious effort to give their motives the quite possibly undeserved strong benefit of the doubt, which I suppose is easy enough when the effects of such attitudes don't impact me personally - once the ruling was made, imposing the loss of the prom and the memories that many students would take from it on the entire student body was flat out petulant, and that's probably putting it kindly. This isn't a religious function: grow the frak up, for godsakes. Rolling Eyes

As for the second: To whit, was the girl right in pressing the suit as far and hard as she did....?

*Takes a deep breath* When considering certain sensitive issues, I find helpful to consider what I call an 'equivalent' - that is, a hypothetical scenario completely outside the sphere of the issue at hand, that nonetheless raises the same or similar moral issues. For example, suppose one day you were to awaken in a hospital. You are informed that you were kidnapped, then rendered and kept unconscious. Furthermore, this was done so that the patient now lying in the bed next to you - whose liver had failed and was literally hours from death - could be supportively connected to your liver(thus explaining why you're feeling so bloody miserable). This was not - let's say his - was not at his bequest; he was already comatose when certain un-scrupulous associates of his did this to you(never mind why), and he may awake in an hour, or tomorrow. Or never. If he recovers, he may hope for many healthy years and decades ahead. If the connection is cut, he will without question be dead within the day. You were found and rescued, and now must choose weather or not to disconnect him. Now, here's a scenario where you've been violated - deeply, physically and immorally violated - to possibly save the life of this innocent. Are you, morally, free to cut the chord? Or is there a moral obligation to allow the violation to continue? (I'll trust the general intelligence of this board to understand what issue/s this is a stand-in for. Wink )

So, coming back to the link in the title post for this thread, consider this scenario instead. Suppose one of the students wanting to attend their senior prom was from an immigrant family hailing from a very remote, isolated tribal culture, whose normal dress is, shall we say, very 'minimalist' by our cultural standards. Razz However, 'When in Rome - '. Most of the time conforming to our expectations of dress in public and at school isn't an issue at all for him. However, for some cultural reason arcane to us(but deeply important to him), he feels that if he attend this function, it 'should' be in traditional dress, placing him just a bit outside the school's standard dress code I would guess. He and/or his family are prepared to take the matter to court and worse, he wishes to bring the daughter of a neighbouring family from the same tribe - you guessed it - also dressed 'traditionally'.

Now, the 'culture shock' is perhaps a bit stronger in this scenario, and one could argue weather the analogy of 'deeply held cultural beliefs' to an expression of sexual identity is really a fair one, but I think the difficult issues raised in this 'thought experiment' compare very closely, well enough that considering one might help inform opinion on the other. As a way of shedding a different light on issues I think it's helpful to consider apart from their baggage when possible. Just something to think about.... Confused
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tobi3B
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 12, 2010 7:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What can I say.
Itīs ridiculous to cancel a prom because of a lesbian couple who wants to
have fun with their friends there.
Next they cancel proms because a african/chinese/indian person wants to participate.The pastor said "but a lot more people here have biblically based values." Oh come on as soon as you have a divergent faith they had to cancel and nobody can say that every student there goes to the same church has the same faith.
and as a last thing did anybody register that the artikel got censored?
The statement of the major is gone and that most school board members comes out of wealthy old families.
And Howell if a couple comes out of a tribe and would only wearing minimal clothing with ceremonial jewelry. I would try not to stare to much and trying to strike a conversation to know what belief is behind their clothing. Very Happy
My two cents

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Howellfan
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 12, 2010 7:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So would I! Smile

Just trying to offer a different angle for looking at the case. Mileage may vary. Razz No 'correct' answer implied(just to be clear Smile ) Notice that I never answered my second question about the article. Wink
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Syrius
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 12, 2010 8:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Two cute girls holding each other, being affectionate and maybe kissing... Shouldn't the entire football team be pledging their support? Twisted Evil

(Please forgive me. Cold shower for me.)

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tobi3B
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 12, 2010 10:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Canīt resist Very Happy
http://fergoandenrique.comicgenesis.com/d/20070417.html
http://fergoandenrique.comicgenesis.com/d/20070425.html

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Cookie
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 12, 2010 12:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

To quote Benleopard: "the fact this takes place in the deep south is not that surprising."

In my many years of living in Louisiana I can personally tell you that; the deep south blows. It has a enormous amount of cultural growing still to accomplish. They have trouble growing because they are glued to 'tradition', which is nothing more than irrational pride.

The worst states of the bunch are Louisiana, South Carolina and Mississippi. Believe it or not, Alabama seems to be moving ahead much faster than it gets credit for. Tennessee and Arkansas don't seem nearly as prejudiced either, but as a whole, the south needs to finally let go of itself and grow.

On the subject of racism, please note that the blacks are equally as guilty as the whites now. The segregation down here is shockingly common, but it's as much one side as the other.

I digress, when it comes to stupidity and intolerance towards gays, race, gender and religion, that is everywhere, especially in the US. Hell, I know where a Klan rally is held in New York state. The north! The Yankee north! However, it isn't the mere presence of it in the south, it's the frequent events around it and the lengths many southerners (Black and White) will go to, that makes the south seem as though it's stuck in the dark ages.

Don't get me wrong, I do not hate the south, but these are facts. The truth is harsh. Our entire nation (USA) needs to catch up, but no portion of it is farther behind than the south.

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CUDDLESMUCH
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 12, 2010 4:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

......wtf people wtf
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Concolor
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 12, 2010 4:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

South_Munjoy wrote:
Benleopard wrote:
Some people in the response both for and against the article. But the fact this takes place in the deep south is not that surprising.


This is true. On another note, you see some really odd juxtapositions of logic in the south as well. When I lived in South Carolina one thing that struck me as odd was a pickup truck with an Obama '08 sticker on one side of the rear bumper, and on the other side of the bumper a sticker that supported SC's constitutional amendment to deny rights for Gay people.


I've lived in various places in South Carolina for the last 18 years, and my take-away from the experience is that I need to get the HAIL out of this state! As soon as my oldest daughter finishes her undergrad degree, we are SO OUTTAHERE!

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Wulfie_Vulphyre
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 12, 2010 11:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mogthemoogle wrote:
To quote Benleopard: "the fact this takes place in the deep south is not that surprising."

In my many years of living in Louisiana I can personally tell you that; the deep south blows. It has a enormous amount of cultural growing still to accomplish. They have trouble growing because they are glued to 'tradition', which is nothing more than irrational pride.

The worst states of the bunch are Louisiana, South Carolina and Mississippi. Believe it or not, Alabama seems to be moving ahead much faster than it gets credit for. Tennessee and Arkansas don't seem nearly as prejudiced either, but as a whole, the south needs to finally let go of itself and grow.

On the subject of racism, please note that the blacks are equally as guilty as the whites now. The segregation down here is shockingly common, but it's as much one side as the other.

I digress, when it comes to stupidity and intolerance towards gays, race, gender and religion, that is everywhere, especially in the US. Hell, I know where a Klan rally is held in New York state. The north! The Yankee north! However, it isn't the mere presence of it in the south, it's the frequent events around it and the lengths many southerners (Black and White) will go to, that makes the south seem as though it's stuck in the dark ages.

Don't get me wrong, I do not hate the south, but these are facts. The truth is harsh. Our entire nation (USA) needs to catch up, but no portion of it is farther behind than the south.



I can totally agree with you Mog. I've been in the south for 11 years now. Let me tell you we've got a group at work that's ALWAYS screamin NAACP when they don't get their way on something. ( 2 really close friends to be exact ) One of them was saying it because she wasn't on the list to be trained for a special task. Problem is there was 2 other black girls on there. My school years were pretty much the same way. You walk down each hallway and it was pretty much branded by race. We had a white hall, black hall, hispanic hall, and then the freak/grunge hall ( consisting of a mix of each race, and "stereotype group" Jocks, preppies, grunge and what not ) The grunge hall was pretty much the most tolerant people in the school. We were like all the kids who didn't give a crap what ya were, so long as you weren't a jack arse.

The one thing I will say about TN getting better, is that I went to prom my junior year. We had a gay male couple, and 3 lesbian couples attend with No issues about who wore what. In 2 of the lesbian couples both wore tuxes, the other couple both wore dresses. Everyone was happy minus a few intolerant blockheads. The intolerant got told " If you don't like it, you may avert your eyes or you may leave. " This was back in 2004.

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Benleopard
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 13, 2010 3:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

LOL... Hurray... something I learned from my mom's parents (who grew up in Maryland) and told me a lot about is taken for a count. Some people just need to wake up and realize that the world has changed from WW2.
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RCraccoon
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 13, 2010 7:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

um feel free to delete this or ignore it but did somone delete my post here? i could have sworn i had posted something
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ScottyDM
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 14, 2010 10:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sounds like the school board is just being lazy or stupid. Maybe they don't want to spend money on a prom and the girls have given them a convenient excuse to cancel it.

As for dress code, do you need anything beyond being modest and stylish?

S~

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