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Shoobie Registered User
Joined: 01 Mar 2005 Posts: 64 Location: Fairfax County Virginia
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Posted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 9:40 am Post subject: Furry Publishing |
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( This thread is a continuation from a subtopic of this thread: http://www.planetfurry.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=5226 )
For those of you not familiar with the current conversation, some of us were talking about furry publishing, the pros and cons involved, experiences and trials, and so on.
Have a cookie (I promise it's not dangerous) and come whimper/howl a bit! ^..^
*drags in some bean-bag chairs, curls up on one* |
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Tygon Site Owner
Joined: 03 Apr 2001 Posts: 2497 Location: Isernhagen, Lowersaxony, Germany
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Posted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 11:43 am Post subject: |
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I still stand to what I said. It is almost impossible for an unknown hobby author to get published properly, especially when the story is something with furry content, no matter what type of story it is.
I'm just going to let Mike publish my stories when I get them done. _________________ Tygon Panthera - name and species
www.planetfurry.com/~tygon/ |
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Shoobie Registered User
Joined: 01 Mar 2005 Posts: 64 Location: Fairfax County Virginia
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Posted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 12:14 pm Post subject: |
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I think that maybe a lot of furry writers don't consider all the other possibilities for getting their works publish. (And no one said you had to have your work published by a household-name publisher for it to be an accomplishment worthy of praise.)
Don't forget about literary magazines, short-story publications, newspaper story sections, college literary publications, and more.
You don't have to create the great american novel, or do something that's going to get put on a Walden-Book's shelf. |
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Tygon Site Owner
Joined: 03 Apr 2001 Posts: 2497 Location: Isernhagen, Lowersaxony, Germany
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Posted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 1:02 pm Post subject: |
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Are you doing that? I understand that you have written a rather long story. Are you sending manuscripts to pulishers? Are you submitting short stories to magazines?
Other than that, have you ever thought of that some people might just be doing this for fun? To have a creative outlet with no desire to be published?
I appreciate that you want to see more furry stories in published literature. I think everyone here does that but please stop making it sounds as if we're committing crimes by not dedicating every free minute to this cause.
I personally have a life that I need to get in order before I can spend time writing a story worth publishing by a major publisher or a magazine or whatever and finding someone to do so. Until then I keep writing for fun and, if something good comes out of that I will let Mike print and sell it because I think he is doing a damn good job with that. _________________ Tygon Panthera - name and species
www.planetfurry.com/~tygon/ |
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Vee Are Are Schee Mini-Boss
Joined: 12 Oct 2003 Posts: 943 Location: sneaking in dark corners
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Posted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 1:25 pm Post subject: |
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Well, I'm one of those lunatics that actually intend on making a living off of his writing. I'll invariably end up doing something along the side to pay the bills, but yeah.
I'd like to propose a question more than anything; what sort of furry stories are being submitted for publication? I've read myself around in the fandom, and I've seen that a large portion of furry literature is really "humans in furry suits." This is fine for the fandom, but I imagine a publisher would say, "Well, other than a few animal quirks, they all act like humans. What's the point?"
I also would agree with the idea that publishers are afraid to try anything new; they're just like the video game and movie market, I'll make the wild jump and say. A great video game comes out, thirty others follow trying to siphon off it's fame. A video game does well, well, that means that a sequal will do even better, right?
Or something. I'm not experienced or pathetic (the opposite of apathetic!) to have thought about this long enough to have come up with any valid points. Shoot my words down, and we'll roast s'mores over the flaming wreckage!
Even though I don't like me the s'mores. |
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anthony Site Owner
Joined: 12 Nov 2001 Posts: 1304 Location: Norway
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Posted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 4:15 pm Post subject: |
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As far as I know, there are 4 ways to get published...
1. Ego-stroking, like Lulu.com
2. Established publishers who does furry...
(I can only think of United Publications)
3. Stealth, but making the book not look furry...
That means downplaying the furry attributes and making the main characters human.
4. Raccoons Bookshelf...
Well, there is the fifth method, too: do it all by paw yourself...
(Print your stories on a laserprinter, bind it and sell using PayPal or on cons)
But that will probably give the least recognicion...
Technical details....
What is the best tool for making PDFs?
I'm leaning towards OpenOffice which is free and can save directly to .PDF
(The 2.0 Beta is out now and looks good)
Anyone knows a good way to bind pages and which looks better than staples(only good for about 80sheets) or the plastic spiral spines?
Just asking as I have a whole heap of stories printed on A5 paper(about 6" x 8.5") which are in danger of falling apart...
(Including the first season of Thorhammer) _________________ "My name's Lion, Anthony Lion"
A fur with a license to purr...
---
Like my Avatar?
Why not surf over to www.micecomics.com and tell Mary what a stellar job she did... |
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Elfen_Furry Moderator
Joined: 18 Jun 2002 Posts: 2601 Location: NYC NY
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Posted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 7:09 pm Post subject: |
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There used to be a self publishing magazine here in the states a long time ago, and printing was one of their major areas of techno-babble. Book binding was another. I forget the name but still have them laying around the house and got to find them.
I also did book binding and printing in Jr High School when such skills were taught. Its not that hard to bind a book together. But its time comsuming when done by hand.
If I find then, I'll scan them and post them here in a 'how to' thread.
Hint: you'll need a big vise and a lot of glue. _________________ SHARKS In The Gene Pool South of Kosovo!
*CHOMP!* |
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starslayer Registered User
Joined: 13 Jan 2005 Posts: 35 Location: Westerville, Ohio, USA
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Posted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 7:35 pm Post subject: |
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you could buy a heat binder. we have one here they are not to difficult to use, but if you use them alot they tend to brake. you can get them on ebay for not to much money. _________________ Those who walk in darkness fear no shadows.
furry code: FDDcmpsw3dw A- C? D-- H-- M? P- R+++ T++ W- Z- Sm- RLU a- cln++ d-- e- f-- h* i+ j+ p* sm-
Avatar image used with permission by Jakkal check her stuff out here http://www.drakkolupen.com/main.asp |
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Cirrel Registered User
Joined: 29 Mar 2003 Posts: 265 Location: 400 miles north of everywhere
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Posted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 8:15 pm Post subject: |
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There is a process printing houses use called 'Perfect Binding'. It takes the double-sided sheets you've printed (A5 size is best) trims them, grinds groves in the binding edge, adds glue to the binding edge, wraps the cover over it all, and finally re-trims the book to its final size. If you provide all the materials (printed pages & Covers) the process is about $8-$10 per book for runs of 50 or less. The price per book will drop somewhat for larger runs.
However, if you're willing to come up with the cash for a run of say 500 copies, a good printing firm can create paper (Heavy fiber-board) printing plates that can do the actual page printing. (Paper Plates are cheaper than metal printing plates but are only for small runs of 1000 books or less.) They can also help print heavy 'glossy' covers, but you have to create the cover art yourself. They will then cut and trim the pages and do the 'perfect binding' thing. A run of 500 copies will drop the unit price per book down to about $6 per copy. This would require a cash layout of about $3000 on your part, but you would have 500 perfect bound books ready for sale. Remember though, this is just a Printing house, NOT a publishing house. The only thing printers do is print. They will not do anything as far as content goes. Cover design, from the art, to the back-cover blurb, to the spine title, to the price (and even a bar-code) is strictly up to you. Other inside information like copyright and disclaimer statements are also up to you.
So now you have 500 books ready for sale and a $3000 hole in your wallet. How you price your work is up to you, but as far as the fandom goes, anything abouve $12 to $15 a copy will prolly be overpriced. Then you have to include the price of hauling those books to Cons or at least shipping them.
Advertising? Well, you could auction some on FurBid, or there are outfits out there like Second Edition Mail Order or Rabbit Valley Comic Shop that will include your book in their Catalogues as long as you can show an ability to ship on demand. As to getting on Amazon.com, well, ya gotta get your book an ISBN number and maybe even a Library of Congress number. Anyway, the more 'official' your book gets, the more exposure it may get. The most 'official' furry book I've seen is one called "Redeeming Factors" by Jim Lane (I have a signed copy) and it looks every bit as real as any in a bookstore. Jim's problem now is finding a new publisher. (His old one went down the tubes. Publishing is a tough business.)
So, theres lots of ways (and lots of work) to get a book from 'pen to published book.'
Good luck kiddies.
Cirrel _________________
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Tygon Site Owner
Joined: 03 Apr 2001 Posts: 2497 Location: Isernhagen, Lowersaxony, Germany
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Posted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 9:53 pm Post subject: |
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Cirrel wrote: | The most 'official' furry book I've seen is one called "Redeeming Factors" by Jim Lane (I have a signed copy) and it looks every bit as real as any in a bookstore. Jim's problem now is finding a new publisher. (His old one went down the tubes. Publishing is a tough business.) |
Nice book. Tried to get my copy signed but believe it or not, I have Jim at three cons now and each time I forgot to bring my damn copy!
Interestin tibit, I am the reason that Amazon.de isn't carrying that book anymore. Why? Because I was the only one who ever ordered a copy and it was so expensive for them to get it to Germany they didn't make any money off it. In fact, I think they paid more that I did
As I said, I will stay with Mike and the Raccoon's Bookshelf. I hope Mike will continue to have it grow. And if he doesn't we will make him _________________ Tygon Panthera - name and species
www.planetfurry.com/~tygon/ |
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JonaWolf Registered User
Joined: 18 Oct 2002 Posts: 38 Location: Wild Rose Country
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Posted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 11:12 pm Post subject: |
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I'm not in any real hurry to try and get my stuff published. For one, it'll be a while before I have anything in a completed form, as I'm not exactly the most prolific or quickest author out there. And two, I'm not sure if anything I write is decent enough to ever make it into print.
I write more as a hobby than anything else. I've never really taken myself seriously as an author and I see no real problem with keeping anything I write online and free for anybody to read if they want.
However, seeing something of mine in print would be interesting. Maybe when I finally complete one of my novels I'll see if The Bookshelf wants to put it out in print if there's any demand for it... _________________ I let my mind wander once, but it never came back...
My Stories - LJ |
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Elfen_Furry Moderator
Joined: 18 Jun 2002 Posts: 2601 Location: NYC NY
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Posted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 11:26 pm Post subject: |
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JonaWolf wrote: | However, seeing something of mine in print would be interesting. Maybe when I finally complete one of my novels I'll see if The Bookshelf wants to put it out in print if there's any demand for it... |
Seeing the city's annual book fair (usually in the first weekend of May), many publishers are out there, including many self-published authors selling their wares. The readership is out there, but they are quite fiicky. If they dont like the cover of your book, it wont be sold. So much for judging a book by its cover, its more like- 'If you're gonna be a whore, be the prettiest whore out there.' _________________ SHARKS In The Gene Pool South of Kosovo!
*CHOMP!* |
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kodayu Registered User
Joined: 24 Feb 2005 Posts: 72 Location: Elsewhere (TM)
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Posted: Wed Mar 09, 2005 1:45 pm Post subject: |
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anthony wrote: | What is the best tool for making PDFs?
I'm leaning towards OpenOffice which is free and can save directly to .PDF
(The 2.0 Beta is out now and looks good)
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I use Open Office even for my professional stuff and up to now it hasn't failed me (most especially it didn't crash yet, such as M$ Word) _________________ "We were in the jungle, there were too many of us, we had access to too much money, too much equipment, and little by little we went insane."
Last edited by kodayu on Mon Mar 14, 2005 6:35 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Shoobie Registered User
Joined: 01 Mar 2005 Posts: 64 Location: Fairfax County Virginia
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Posted: Mon Mar 14, 2005 12:30 pm Post subject: |
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A agree whole-heartedly with you, JonaWolf. (BTW, how's the website?)
I think I probably came on into this a bit too forcefully, but I do feel pretty strongly about this. There's a lot of good work sitting in Internet form on the web, that could easily be enjoyed by the general public, and it makes me whimper to think that those people will never get a chance to see it without being in the fandom first.
A lot of furs (myself included) write purely for our own enjoyment, and the fact that others enjoy the works too is only an added plus to our own enjoyment.
I like that idea. I get to bleed out my creativity, and at the same time, maybe make someone else happy. Very cool. ^..^
I guess I just want to express my support for anyone trying to get their stuff into the public, and urge those who haven't thought about it to maybe think about it sometime.
You don't have to get published by a major publisher, or publish a novel for a bookstore shelf. The accomplishment is there for other facets as well.
Also, I just wanted to note that having your works published by a simple printing publisher like Lulu Press is not just for people with enormous egos or the need to pound their ego. It's a great way to professionally present your works to others, and it really helps boost your readership potential. It's also great for those of us who don't really care about getting their book on a Walden-Books shelf but still want their stuff bound with a picture cover and ISBN number. |
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kodayu Registered User
Joined: 24 Feb 2005 Posts: 72 Location: Elsewhere (TM)
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Posted: Thu Mar 17, 2005 6:05 pm Post subject: |
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I found this article on editing and critique on Strange Horizon. It's not a wholly new insight, but it matches our discussion quite well and I think some people might consider it useful:
http://www.strangehorizons.com/2005/20050314/notkin-c.shtml _________________ "We were in the jungle, there were too many of us, we had access to too much money, too much equipment, and little by little we went insane." |
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